Because the comments area on my earlier post got so crowded (yay!), and because I don't want questions or comments to get mixed in with my long question+manuscript posts, I'm starting another post here. Participants, if you have questions or discussion, please attach them as comments onto this post.
More soon...
Thanks for the questions thread.
ReplyDelete5. Couldn't he just tell Morrow what he thinks, below?
Huh?
Great questions! You've given me a lot of interesting things to work on.
ReplyDeleteThanks for all your hard work.
-K.
Catreona,
ReplyDeleteYou've got a line there in quotes:
"The best sailor, and the best judge of horseflesh, you mean; other than that, quite beneath your exalted notice," I thought wryly.
This seemed to mean that he didn't actually say this to Morrow, that he just thought it. I was wondering why he didn't say it out loud.
You're welcome, K. Thank you for taking this so seriously.
ReplyDeleteUh, well... That's not really the sort of thing one says to one's employer; not if one wants to stay employed.
ReplyDeleteCatreona,
ReplyDeleteHe could probably say the first half without being fired, depending on how important he was to Morrow. But regardless, if he's not going to say it aloud, you shouldn't use quotes. Maybe italics?
Just checking in about approach.
ReplyDeleteThis excerpt isn't really the start of my novel. So, some of these questions are clear to a reader who's just seen the raid, or maybe answered a little farther along in this scene, but it seems to me that's not really the point. For this exercise, I should try to get the answers on page here.
I'll be the first to admit I don't think I have much of a writer's compass. It's a very helpful concept, but I think that's what I'm trying to develop right now. I'll try to address all your questions, then let it sit for a day, and edit out anything that doesn't work for me.
Are you going to post a separate blog entry for us to post rewrites in, or do they go here when we're ready?
-K.
The first part of the observation spoken aloud and the second, more obviously wry part merely thought would work, though it takes some adjustment of my mindset. Seems to be a lot of that going on in this workshop *grin*
ReplyDeleteUhhh... Stupid technical question here: No doubt it's because I read by listening rather than by using print or braille, but I don't understand. Don't you denote thoughts by quotes? Thoughts are a species of speech, after all... And, if not by quotes, what is the standard way of denoting thoughts? You mention italics. Is that the standard mode of denotation?
Thanks to K for asking practical questions in this thread.
K,
ReplyDeleteFor the purposes of the workshop, I would indeed recommend that you try to get it onto the page here. For the purposes of the novel, it's less clear. On the other hand, you do set up a really intriguing mystery in this piece if it *is* the first piece of the novel. Your readers will go, "Raid? Raid of what? Is it something *horrible*?" And when they actually find out what it is, their reaction will be amplified.
Not a suggestion, per se, just a thought.
Catreona,
ReplyDeleteI don't think the quotation convention is a hard-and-fast rule. But my own impression when I see quotes is to ready myself for something said aloud, and I think that's pretty common in readers. When I read your piece I actually thought he said it aloud, because the strength of the quotes expectation was such that I totally missed the word "thought."
I usually see thoughts expressed in italics - when they are expressed as you've done them, as in, "*blah blah blah,* he thought."
I tend not to use the expression "he thought"/"she thought" at all, because I take my POV so close to my protagonist that everything in the text is something observed, experienced, or thought by the character.
Which is a long roundabout way of saying that in this case, I would recommend you use italics for his thought - particularly if you're going to distinguish it from the earlier, spoken half of the sentence.
Juliette, you asked if there were some secrecy about the job Morrow has for Charlie. This question puzzled me mightily, until it finally occurred to me that the reader perhaps has no way of knowing that we join the conversation in medias res. By the time we pick it up, Charlie already knows what the job is, and there's no need for either party to keep repeating what it is. Another case of the writer knowing what's going on and completely failing to take into account that the hapless reader might not.
ReplyDeleteaccordingly, for the expanded segment exercise, I've backed up a bit. Now you'll get the entire conversation, albeit modified, and some context for it in Charlie's life and thought.
Catreona,
ReplyDeleteThere's no problem in the guys not mentioning the content if they both know it, but for the reader's sake, it should be implied, at least.
The other secret I wondered about with the job was whether it had some extreme consequences associated with non-completion, and this was a guess that I based on Morrow's extreme discomfort over the idea of delay or possible non-completion of the job. That's not something you have to explain, but if there is something in the author's mind :), maybe you should make Shepherd a little suspicious.
Great questions! The changes I made were minor, but the whole passage seems so much deeper now. I totally didn't realize the intrigue and significance of my last paragraph, but I'm glad you did!
ReplyDeleteNo dier consequences. Sorry to have roused your interest needlessly.
ReplyDeleteI've got performances today and tomorrow, so I thought I'd better post what I had even though I still think it needs editing down. This was a really fun exercise. I'm anxious to read everyone's!
ReplyDelete-K.
Kay,
ReplyDeleteYour segment is fascinating. Just two technical, gramatical points:
Impunity isn't the right word. Impunity means without punishment. But, your characters certainly meet with punishment, that is clear from the segment. I donno, something like brazenness?
Also, "would lay" should be "would lie."
Sorry. *grin* That M.A. in English that essentially trained me to be an English prof. never sleeps.
Glad to pique your interest, Catreona. And thanks for the grammatical points. In case it's not clear, my conscious knowledge of grammar tops out at about School House Rock level, but I've got a good enough ear to get me just far enough to get into real trouble. I thought impunity meant without fear of punishment, and that's an important distinction in this case, lol. 'Lie' as in 'to deceive' is such an important concept in the novel that I don't want to use a homonym for a saying, so I'll come up with something else. Thanks for catching those.
ReplyDelete-K.
You're welcome, K. Thanks for not taking umbridge(sp?) at my interfearence.
ReplyDeleteDavid,
ReplyDeleteI don't mind the scene you sent, but I still hope I get to see your revision of the original one. Can you consider that you've learned a lot of backstory by writing the prequel scene, and put some of those details in under the radar in the scene you originally wrote? Maybe you could find places in there where her motivation was particularly relevant, such as when she decides to look above the water for the second time ("still safe, no predators, and in my current status no one can legitimately punish me" kind of thing).
Juliette,
ReplyDeleteI'm working on it. I hope to get it done soon.
I sent the prequel scene because that's what I had so far. I'm not 100% happy with it (for one thing, I've really overused of the word "choice").
I like your idea of slipping things under the rarad in a revision of the original scene.
More soon.
Okay, two things:
ReplyDelete1) That should be "radar" in my earlier post, not "rarad" - typos are creatures of Darwinian evolution, they camouflage themselves, and are only visible to the author after others can see them, too :)
2) Revision of original scene submitted, after an epic struggle with a recalcitrant computer.